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	<title>Comments on: MMO Rant #1: Overhype</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/</link>
	<description>Game design, development, and industry commentary by MMO Game Designer Ryan Shwayder.</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 02:36:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Kaylena</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-10787</link>
		<dc:creator>Kaylena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Nov 2006 21:30:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-10787</guid>
		<description>I remember you from EQ through EQ2 and I agree with your point and have voiced the same.

However, EQ2 has been guilty of the same offense.  I find it curious why you didn't mention that.  A complete revamp after a game goes live for a year isn't exactly over-hype, but it's a misrepresentation of a product, which is basically what you are complaining about.  It would be interesting to see what your view is on this at post-soe-employment in retrospect.  Legally however, I doubt we'll see that.

SWG, EQ2 and the upcoming on SOE's list, Vanguard, are all guilty of this same offense.  Vanguard was announced even before it had a name IIRC and that has undergone many face-lifts in its hype and it's not even out yet.

Hype will generate attention but what most devs fail to realize, is it's going to garner microscopic analysis they weren't bargaining for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember you from EQ through EQ2 and I agree with your point and have voiced the same.</p>
<p>However, EQ2 has been guilty of the same offense.  I find it curious why you didn&#8217;t mention that.  A complete revamp after a game goes live for a year isn&#8217;t exactly over-hype, but it&#8217;s a misrepresentation of a product, which is basically what you are complaining about.  It would be interesting to see what your view is on this at post-soe-employment in retrospect.  Legally however, I doubt we&#8217;ll see that.</p>
<p>SWG, EQ2 and the upcoming on SOE&#8217;s list, Vanguard, are all guilty of this same offense.  Vanguard was announced even before it had a name IIRC and that has undergone many face-lifts in its hype and it&#8217;s not even out yet.</p>
<p>Hype will generate attention but what most devs fail to realize, is it&#8217;s going to garner microscopic analysis they weren&#8217;t bargaining for.</p>
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		<title>By: redjunkopera</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-10494</link>
		<dc:creator>redjunkopera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Nov 2006 03:11:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-10494</guid>
		<description>You know what annoys the hell out of me...

A developer spends 5+ years and so many millions of dollars trying to make a game... it flops, and then where does all the product go?

I mean a game that cost $20M and 5 years to make still has a lot of capital in it, despite sucking.

Where do MMO's go when they die?  

Is it all just wasted?  Adrift in the ether of IP?

There are a LOT of games out there which are dead and/or dying... what is going to happen to those engines/art/lore/etc when they finally kick off?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know what annoys the hell out of me&#8230;</p>
<p>A developer spends 5+ years and so many millions of dollars trying to make a game&#8230; it flops, and then where does all the product go?</p>
<p>I mean a game that cost $20M and 5 years to make still has a lot of capital in it, despite sucking.</p>
<p>Where do MMO&#8217;s go when they die?  </p>
<p>Is it all just wasted?  Adrift in the ether of IP?</p>
<p>There are a LOT of games out there which are dead and/or dying&#8230; what is going to happen to those engines/art/lore/etc when they finally kick off?</p>
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		<title>By: Preston</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-8715</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 02:57:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-8715</guid>
		<description>Oh I know exactly what you are talking about.  I can not wait until we can officially talk about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh I know exactly what you are talking about.  I can not wait until we can officially talk about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Gaereth</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-8686</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaereth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Oct 2006 22:54:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-8686</guid>
		<description>You example is a strawman creation Phsycho. Its an extreme that some people would enjoy but it is in no way viable or believable.

However, if you hype your game as evolutionary, revolutionary and a true 3rd generation game then it should actually be those things. When it turns out that its mechanics, visuals, and most game play elements are merely a rehash of existing games with a splash of a twist, that tends to turn off a huge chunk of the player base.

Hype is wonderful and great as long as it is actually something that is a realistic part of your game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You example is a strawman creation Phsycho. Its an extreme that some people would enjoy but it is in no way viable or believable.</p>
<p>However, if you hype your game as evolutionary, revolutionary and a true 3rd generation game then it should actually be those things. When it turns out that its mechanics, visuals, and most game play elements are merely a rehash of existing games with a splash of a twist, that tends to turn off a huge chunk of the player base.</p>
<p>Hype is wonderful and great as long as it is actually something that is a realistic part of your game.</p>
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		<title>By: Psychochild</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-8315</link>
		<dc:creator>Psychochild</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Oct 2006 00:59:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-8315</guid>
		<description>I agree with what was mentioned above: you often need to overhype your product if you want to attract enough attention.  Particularly if the attention you want to attract has access to a checkbook.  Showing off a bit of popularity can help loosen the purse strings since it appears you're less of a risk.

The other problem is that, frankly, hype works.  If Game X promises you blowjobs and candy canes while your game promises solid gameplay, people are going to pay attention to Game X.  Those with faith in humankind might say that the people know that a game can't magically produce oral sex and sugary treats, but they still fall for it.  I suspect that in some ways people hope that the hype turns out to be true even though the odds are agasint it.  In the end, being honest doesn't get you the good attention.

Finally, you have the issue that people actually &lt;i&gt;want&lt;/i&gt; the hype!  In Meridian 59 we don't say much about what we have in the pipeline because we understand that we might not be able to complete the project.  Yet, people clamor for more information, reassuring us that, "We understand if you don't complete everything!"  Rants like Ryan's above reassure me otherwise. ;)  If you don't talk about the ZOMG REVOLUTIONARY! things you're doing, people will start to assume you're stagnant.

My thoughts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with what was mentioned above: you often need to overhype your product if you want to attract enough attention.  Particularly if the attention you want to attract has access to a checkbook.  Showing off a bit of popularity can help loosen the purse strings since it appears you&#8217;re less of a risk.</p>
<p>The other problem is that, frankly, hype works.  If Game X promises you blowjobs and candy canes while your game promises solid gameplay, people are going to pay attention to Game X.  Those with faith in humankind might say that the people know that a game can&#8217;t magically produce oral sex and sugary treats, but they still fall for it.  I suspect that in some ways people hope that the hype turns out to be true even though the odds are agasint it.  In the end, being honest doesn&#8217;t get you the good attention.</p>
<p>Finally, you have the issue that people actually <i>want</i> the hype!  In Meridian 59 we don&#8217;t say much about what we have in the pipeline because we understand that we might not be able to complete the project.  Yet, people clamor for more information, reassuring us that, &#8220;We understand if you don&#8217;t complete everything!&#8221;  Rants like Ryan&#8217;s above reassure me otherwise. <img src='http://www.nerfbat.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  If you don&#8217;t talk about the ZOMG REVOLUTIONARY! things you&#8217;re doing, people will start to assume you&#8217;re stagnant.</p>
<p>My thoughts.</p>
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		<title>By: jason</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-7830</link>
		<dc:creator>jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Oct 2006 11:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-7830</guid>
		<description>My problem has always been the disparity between what a developer says and what is actually shown.  "Our game has innovative combat unlike anything you've ever seen."  Followed by the release of a video showing 6 players attacking a monster, tank in front, everyone else is to the back and sides, auto-attacking with some button clicks.  Where is this awesome combat he was just shilling?

At this point, I could almost care less about seeing in game footage... you have graphics! yay! *snore* ... instead, show me a video taken with a camera of someone at a keyboard actually playing the game.  Frankly, a game may look cool as hell, but if when I bring it home it turns out that I push two buttons repeatedly, or worse just push two buttons and relax, to do what the video showed me, I won't be playing long.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My problem has always been the disparity between what a developer says and what is actually shown.  &#8220;Our game has innovative combat unlike anything you&#8217;ve ever seen.&#8221;  Followed by the release of a video showing 6 players attacking a monster, tank in front, everyone else is to the back and sides, auto-attacking with some button clicks.  Where is this awesome combat he was just shilling?</p>
<p>At this point, I could almost care less about seeing in game footage&#8230; you have graphics! yay! *snore* &#8230; instead, show me a video taken with a camera of someone at a keyboard actually playing the game.  Frankly, a game may look cool as hell, but if when I bring it home it turns out that I push two buttons repeatedly, or worse just push two buttons and relax, to do what the video showed me, I won&#8217;t be playing long.</p>
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		<title>By: Moorgard</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-7825</link>
		<dc:creator>Moorgard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-7825</guid>
		<description>"The Apple way only works because Apple has a big devoted fanbase that become day one buyers of ANYTHING they put out. Not too many MMO companies have that. "

If everyone who bought an Ipod also bought a Mac, we'd all be making MMOs for the Macintosh right now.

Most of the people who buy Ipods aren't diehard Apple fans. They buy Ipods because they're an easily recognized market leader; i.e. every other kid in class has one. While Apple certainly has its fanatics, they aren't the ones making them huge. It's the people who recognize the brand and know that an Ipod means quality.

The fact that Apple talks about new products as it releases them only enhances that image of a company that can be relied upon to deliver. Now *that's* something not a lot of MMO companies have.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Apple way only works because Apple has a big devoted fanbase that become day one buyers of ANYTHING they put out. Not too many MMO companies have that. &#8221;</p>
<p>If everyone who bought an Ipod also bought a Mac, we&#8217;d all be making MMOs for the Macintosh right now.</p>
<p>Most of the people who buy Ipods aren&#8217;t diehard Apple fans. They buy Ipods because they&#8217;re an easily recognized market leader; i.e. every other kid in class has one. While Apple certainly has its fanatics, they aren&#8217;t the ones making them huge. It&#8217;s the people who recognize the brand and know that an Ipod means quality.</p>
<p>The fact that Apple talks about new products as it releases them only enhances that image of a company that can be relied upon to deliver. Now *that&#8217;s* something not a lot of MMO companies have.</p>
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		<title>By: Arashi</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-7809</link>
		<dc:creator>Arashi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Oct 2006 20:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-7809</guid>
		<description>It comes down to putting their money where their mouth is. When those early stages of development are announced, companies shouldn't even talk about plans for  certain areas of gameplay. The reason being that most likely whjen it comes to implementation, it won't match up to the ideaology of the concept. 

Not living up to the concept is what turns players and customers off from a project. 

On the flip side it is important too for players and fans to not take every drop of information as though it is the life energy of the universe. Sometimes it benefits a developer to put forth an idea and see what others think of it. In practice, it may not work that way. Players tend to take those words as gospel and build an expectation that the dev team can't hope to achieve.

Lesson: Only divulge ideas that you can reasonably implement</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It comes down to putting their money where their mouth is. When those early stages of development are announced, companies shouldn&#8217;t even talk about plans for  certain areas of gameplay. The reason being that most likely whjen it comes to implementation, it won&#8217;t match up to the ideaology of the concept. </p>
<p>Not living up to the concept is what turns players and customers off from a project. </p>
<p>On the flip side it is important too for players and fans to not take every drop of information as though it is the life energy of the universe. Sometimes it benefits a developer to put forth an idea and see what others think of it. In practice, it may not work that way. Players tend to take those words as gospel and build an expectation that the dev team can&#8217;t hope to achieve.</p>
<p>Lesson: Only divulge ideas that you can reasonably implement</p>
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		<title>By: Raph</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-7804</link>
		<dc:creator>Raph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:41:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-7804</guid>
		<description>The Apple way only works because Apple has a big devoted fanbase that become day one buyers of ANYTHING they put out. Not too many MMO companies have that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Apple way only works because Apple has a big devoted fanbase that become day one buyers of ANYTHING they put out. Not too many MMO companies have that.</p>
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		<title>By: Wolfgangdoom</title>
		<link>http://www.nerfbat.com/2006/10/12/mmo-rant-1-overhype/comment-page-1/#comment-7803</link>
		<dc:creator>Wolfgangdoom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nerfbat.com/?p=162#comment-7803</guid>
		<description>Word of mouth is key as you pointed out. All of my friends who play MMO's do so because I thought the game was great and recommended it to them once they expressed burnout with the games they were currently playing. My friends and I seem to bounce around together from MMO to MMO and the one thing we always talk about is what we like about the new game vs the old game and what we miss about the old. 

Personally I don't care what magazines have to say about video games because magazine publishers know about as much about me as they know about their own kids (they might know a little, but not enough to change my mind). With that being said, my friends and my wife know what games I like to play and thus they know what to recommend. I enjoy laughing about the hype that is created for most games because who doesn't enjoy a good round of BS everynow and then? What I don't enjoy is false promises, crappy user interfaces, or insane timesinks once the game is released.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Word of mouth is key as you pointed out. All of my friends who play MMO&#8217;s do so because I thought the game was great and recommended it to them once they expressed burnout with the games they were currently playing. My friends and I seem to bounce around together from MMO to MMO and the one thing we always talk about is what we like about the new game vs the old game and what we miss about the old. </p>
<p>Personally I don&#8217;t care what magazines have to say about video games because magazine publishers know about as much about me as they know about their own kids (they might know a little, but not enough to change my mind). With that being said, my friends and my wife know what games I like to play and thus they know what to recommend. I enjoy laughing about the hype that is created for most games because who doesn&#8217;t enjoy a good round of BS everynow and then? What I don&#8217;t enjoy is false promises, crappy user interfaces, or insane timesinks once the game is released.</p>
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