Off Topic: Ordered New Computer – Thanks!
After all of the research and advice, I ended up ordering a beast of a system (in my opinion). I went with an i7 920 processor after all was said and done, and got some highly recommended bang-for-the-buck hardware otherwise. I’m super friggin’ excited about building a new computer. My current desktop is 4+ years old, and I bought a Dell because I got a 40% discount on it. So it’s been a good 6 years since I’ve built a system. Crazy! You can check out my final configuration here: Shwayder’s i7 Config. Thanks to everyone for all the great feedback and help!
HEPL!
The DDR3 memory will be a faster than the DDR2 memory, but not so much that it outweighs having double the memory .
So as is, the DDR2 config looks better, but you need to consider the future as well.
If you expect to expand your DD3 memory anytime soon, go for that.
The ability to take advantage of the memory depends on what FSB speed you have. I wrote this stuff down from a website that now has a dead link, but here is a link to my blog post where I covered this: http://word-of-shadow.blogspot.com/2008/09/building-new-modestly-cheap-computer.html
Basically, for FSB at or below 533 MHz, you will not surpass the bandwidth capabilities of DDR2 @ 1066 MHz. Beyond this point, DDR3 would become useful.
The CPU you’re talking about has a 333 MHz FSB (you’ll see it quoted as 1333, but THAT is in units of “megatransfers per second”, see “http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front-side_bus” for more info).
With that CPU you would need to overclock by a ridiculous amount to reach the limit of what DDR2 can do…. so DDR3 will be fairly useless for you. DDR2 800 would be fine.
FYI, both mobos can support up to 400 MHz FSB (it is then conceivable you could overclock to 533 and hence push the limits of DDR2, but I’m guessing you probably won’t overclock, and certainly not by that much).
Of course, if you changed your mind and went with one of the new i7 mobo’s, you’d have to go DDR3 because they don’t take DDR2. So if you wanted your memory to be useful in the future, you could go that route. Then again, DDR2 800 is really fricking cheap, so I’d just stick with that.
NB: The 790i would allow you to upgrade to a 400 MHz (aka 1600 FSB) CPU further down the track, whereas the 780i would not (it only is listed as supporting 1333 FSB, i.e. 333 MHz).
Thanks! Gonna read your article Melf.
Also, if it wasn’t obvious, I want to leave myself open to SLI in the future, which is why I’m going with the nForce stuff.
That said, I keep reading about how the Intel boards seem to be more reliable, so I might consider just get an Intel P45-based motherboard and stick with a single graphics card (then upgrade to a better card instead of going SLI).
And, of course, make sure you have a decent power source. LOL. My USB terminals wouldn’t work. It was because I installed a weak power source. I was checking for viruses and crap and all along my machine wasn’t getting enough powah!
Why don’t you get the new Core i7?
Because the cheaper Core i7 is slower and more expensive than the Core 2 Quads (9400 and above).
doesn’t DDR3 ram produce less heat? a consideration with how much prices have dropped recently.
@Ryan: how are you rating your speeds of CPUs? just by clock? or by actual performance? because transfer speeds have something to do with it as well, not just final caclulation speed. the FSB has been a huge bottleneck for a while (note that AMD got away from it a while ago, and intel followed them, not the other way around).
I would go for the DDR3 – You will probably get to re-use it, more-so than DDR2
I read that a lot about the NVIDIA boards too, and I ended up getting a Gigabyte P45…. no complaints yet
On the i7 thing, I think it depends what you want to do with it. If you’re just playing high end games, the CPU doesn’t matter that much. But the i7′s are reported as being 20-30% better if you’re doing a lot of parallel processing on the CPU, so if you’re doing massive number crunching and such then it can be worth it. Which is why I got an i7 for the work computer I put together recently (lots of real-time data processing going on).
I wouldn’t be too fussed about running in SLI unless you’re one of those superhuman people who can tell the difference between, say, 60 and 80 fps ^^ From what I’ve seen/read, there’s always a cheaper single graphics card available that gets the frame rate high enough so that you won’t notice any improvements, compared to running anything in SLI (unless you’re running Crysis at max resolution with full AA / AF etc).
@Defect 9
I’m talking about all the round-ups I’ve looked at for CPUs, such as at Tom’s Hardware (and everything I could find at Sharky Extreme, HardOCP, and Anandtech). They tend to all rate the Core 2 Quad 9400 as measurably faster for gaming than the i7 920. This is nice because the quad is significantly cheaper than the i7, and the motherboards for them are the same story.
If I get evidence to the contrary on gaming performance, and I can find a good i7 motherboard for the $150 and below range, I might pony up and get an i7 instead of the Core 2 Quad. I’m trying to hold off on buying for a few more days to do my due diligence with research and looking at responses here.
@whoever…
I got my D-Link DIR-655 Xtreme N Gigabit Router in today. It’s friggin’ hot. I loved my old Belkin Wireless G Plus Router, but I’ve been pushing a lot through the air pipes lately with streaming to my 360 (while doing several other things simultaneously), and I can already notice a difference. Yay.
However many hours later and… my D-Link DIR-655 no longer puts out a wireless signal. It just died in the middle of me using it. 2.5 hours later with normal and senior techs, and it is being returned. Argh. It worked so damn well before it died… for about 2 hours.
SLI isn’t worth pursuing unless you have two high end cards at the same time. Then you’ve got the joys of driver problems and SLI compatibility with whatever games you’re playing. Use your single 9800GTX for a year or so and then replace it with another card in the same price/performance zone.
I’d recommend the P45 system, since its cheaper. However I’d ditch the zalman cooler and arctic silver and use the intel stock cooler.
After a lot more research, I might actually go with the i7. I’ve done a bunch of reconfiguring and got a pretty kickass system built for around $1200 (actually a little under after I get combo deals, which don’t appear on wish lists).
http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=6727249
I ditched the cooler and arctic silver in part because I’m not planning on overclocking and in part because applying that madness is one of the things I tend to dread about building a system. It also saves me a bit of cash.
The gains I’d get from the better ram and generally slightly better processor (which it seems even the i7 920 is, despite my original research) seem to outweigh the small sacrifices I have to make to keep the price down (550w PSU, which is more than enough, for example).
I’m looking forward to your thoughts on the rig once you get it set up. Specifically, I want to hear about how much noise the stock cooler does or doesnt make.
I admit, even if not overclocking, i probably would have still gone aftermarket cooling, but that’s only cause low noise is important to me. Other than that tiny difference, I say you put together a solid system.
Hmm, almost the same setup I chose to go with, except I took a GeForce 285 vid card and a 1000W power supply. I already had a smaller system drive, so I just ended up buying a 1.5TB drive for $99 bucks (on sale). Nice lookin system!
Sweet. I only got the 550W PSU because I’m not planning on doing anything fancy and don’t think I’ll ever go SLI (though this should have the wattage to handle it according to the Corsair website). I only got a 150GB drive because it’s one of the most ignored yet most important components for system/game performance, and this one will scream. I also have a 1TB external drive for backup, so I didn’t need space.
As for the cooling, Defect 9 pushed me back over the fence. I ordered a Zalman cooler and some Arctic Silver 5. The instructions on Arctic Silver’s website make this look much easier than I remember (I used to clean the CPU and heatsink with with rubbing alcohol, rub a tiny amount of thermal paste on the heatsink and rub it into the pores with a coffee filter, then use a razor to cover the entire die of the CPU with a paper thin layer of thermal paste… Now apparently you can just clean them off with rubbing alcohol, put a small strip on the CPU, drop the heatsink on and twist it a few degrees to ditch the bubbles, and you’re done).
Sure, I’m not going to overclock, but keeping everything cool will extend the life of the computer.
Heehee, didn’t mean to do that to your wallet. Funny thing is, you’ll be able to get a quick 20% OC without even thinking about it, and your temps should STILL be better than with the stock cooler (assuming you don’t set the fan speed to crappy low).
a half-pea sized dot of the Arctic Silver dead center on the CPU is more than enough assuming you drop it on their semi-perfectly. if you can twist the cooler after you mount it solid, see if there’s a way to either bend the mounts (not too much) so they apply more pressure, or if there’s some way to throw a spacer or something in there between the mount and the heatsink to get slightly more pressure (yes, you’ll have to un-mount it, if you care). it won’t get you much, probably only a 1-2c difference, but you’ll ensure that it has proper contact.
You’ll probably want to mount the cooler before mounting the mobo.
I see you took my advice and got the i7, let me know how it works out for you.
I have an i7 so let’s get that full disclosure out of the way. The i7 is a significant architecture change from everything Intel has done in the past. They finally gave in to the superior approach AMD was taking with it’s Opteron chips and integrated the memory controller onto the die. This eliminates the FSB and nearly triples memory bandwidth to the CPU at the same time. Look at the memory tests on Tom’s Hardware. The difference is stunning. The i7 is also Hyperthreaded so my 920 shows 8 CPUs under Vista 64. In most tests the i7 is better than the Quad 9550.
That said, I think I got a comparable deal directly through dell on their XPS Studio M45 machine. I have 2GB more RAM and no velociraptor drive for about the same money and I bought mine at Christmas time so it’s bound to be cheaper now.
As for the video card, I’m partial to ATI under Windows Vista because of NVIDIA’s early issues with getting working drivers out there for Vista. ATI seems to have a great bargain in the 4K series and I wouldn’t care about SLI because you’ll end up upgrading the card to a bigger one before you add another small card. You can even get one of the X2 cards if you’re that hell bent on dual video cards that 90% of games don’t really use.
Enjoy the i7. I think it was the right choice for me and I’m sure you’ll see the same value for you.
The bang-for-the-buck beast is built! I dub thee Luckbeast.
Luckbeast is functional and in need of driver updates. With only the video card driver update, it got an Windows Experience Index score of 5.9. I’m hoping the latest drivers and bios will get that to an even 6.0 for looks.
congrats!
but… no pics?
It is about time for me to upgrade as well. I think its been about 5 years for me and I seem to be having an intermittent hardware issue too. I may put off building a new system though, I’m not sure I’m ready for i7 yet, and I would still prefer avoiding Vista if possible. Maybe I’ll wait for Windows 7? :p
I like the setup you decided upon. I think it should work fine. I also agree with the person who mentioned they picked up a larger power supply. I think I will do the same. My old power supply was a good one and its lasted me through two systems and its probably approaching 10 years now. I think I got my money’s worth out of that one, but I don’t think I could have used it in my last system if it had been just sufficient for the first one. That being said, I was thinking 550w to 600w is a good starting point. In case it wasn’t stressed already, a good power supply is worth the price. If anyone reading is considering a cheap one, reconsider!
I also think the Artic Silver and Zalman cooler were worth getting, although it has been my experience that the GPU is a greater concern when it comes to cooling. My friends had issues with their computers when playing 3D intensive games, but the cases and video cards they were using probably contributed to the problem. You should be fine.
heh, I already have the same HD on hand ready to either install in my current setup, or for use in a new one. Good choice!
No one said much about the case, but perhaps in the big scheme of things that isn’t important. I’m still using my first case, but its time for a new one. Cases are much nicer now and there are a lot more options to consider. I like some of those Antec cases, especially when they are on sale! :p
My research was turning up similar results to what everyone else was commenting here, and it looks like you already had a pretty good handle on it. A second and third opinion for reassurance never hurts though! =)
Thanks for sharing, Douglas
Hey guys. I didn’t have time to log in. But maybe you guys can help me. I don’t know enough about computers to successfully build one, and I have a 1200 budget. Currently I have no computer to play any type of game, hardly pacman. Here is the question, what should I go with? Any suggestions?